Ddg Classe Zumwalt

[Ramius80]

Una nave sicuramente innovativa (e costosa). Forse tutte le navi del futuro (non troppo lontano) saranno così

[Totiano*]

temo tu abbia ragione, Ramius, e anche i battelli potrebbero cambiare forme. C'è una nuova tendenza a mostrare progetti di sommergibili più che sottomarini (sopratutto da DCN)

[Iscandar]

quella più che una vela mi pare un tre alberi...

[Ramius80]

Notavo che anche il sistema di propulsione è abbastanza originale...

[Totiano*]

CONSEGNATO LO ZUMWALT

è ufficilamente entrato in servizio nella US Navy il vascello (non rieco a chiamarlo caccia, disloca quasi come una nave da battaglia) ritenuto il più potente al mondo. E' avvenuto sabato 15 ottobre 2016 a Baltimora. Ecco l'articolo disponibile al link http://www.defencetalk.com/us-navys-most-advanced-warship-uss-zumwalt-commissions-in-baltimore-68416

US Navy’s Most Advanced Warship, USS Zumwalt Commissions in Baltimore

The Navy’s newest and most technologically advanced warship, USS Zumwalt (DDG 1000) was commissioned into active service Saturday, Oct. 15, at North Locust Point in Baltimore.

Zumwalt, the lead ship of a class of next-generation multi-mission destroyers, features a state-of-the-art electric propulsion system, wave-piercing tumblehome hull, stealth design, and the latest warfighting technology and weaponry available.

Secretary of the Navy, the Hon. Ray Mabus, delivered the ceremony’s principal address.

“This ship is an example of a larger initiative to increase operational stability and give the U.S. a strategic advantage,” said Mabus. “Our Navy and our Marine Corps, uniquely, provide presence – around the globe, around the clock – ensuring stability, reassuring allies, deterring adversaries, and providing the nation’s leaders with options in times of crisis.”

The ship’s co-sponsors, Ann Zumwalt and Mouzetta Zumwalt-Weathers, are daughters of former Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Elmo R. Zumwalt, Jr., after whom the ship is named. The sisters were an integral part of the ceremony, giving the order to “man our ship and bring her to life,” in keeping with naval tradition.

The Zumwalt-class destroyer will be capable of performing a range of deterrence, power projection, sea control, and command and control missions while allowing the Navy to evolve with new systems and missions. It does all of this while maintaining its stealth – making this visually imposing ship difficult to find whether close to the shore or far out to sea.

“Today’s ceremony marked the culmination of over three years of dedication and hard work by some of the finest Sailors I have had the pleasure to lead,” said Capt. James A. Kirk, commanding officer of Zumwalt. “The only thing more impressive than the capabilities of the ship are the capabilities of its fine crew.”

Zumwalt will challenge adversaries and their way of thinking about how we employ our forces, providing an asymmetric advantage. Working with Arleigh Burke-class destroyers, littoral combat ships, and amphibious ships to form adaptive force packages, Zumwalt-class destroyers will use its computing capabilities to make these groups more lethal through increased range, deception, computer integration, and data analysis from various platforms. With its stealth, size, power, and advanced combat systems, this warship will serve as a centerpiece for deterrence and stability in the maritime environment.

“This destroyer, like the others in our fleet, is capable of projecting power, no doubt,” said Mabus. “The Zumwalt-class is much larger than today’s destroyers with a considerably larger flight deck – enough space to operate host Joint Strike Fighters, MV-22 Ospreys, and unmanned systems and a Vertical Launch System second to none.”

In addition to its size, the Zumwalt class will be the first Navy warships to utilize an integrated power system that will produce enough power to run current systems, as well as the power required for future weapons, computing, and sensor systems. Zumwalt generates approximately 78 megawatts of power, almost as much as a nuclear-powered aircraft carrier. This means the ship can operate all of its systems and still generate enough electricity to power a small town, which provides the extra capacity to accommodate future weapons and computing systems. Combined with its size and power, Zumwalt will be able to integrate emerging technologies and new capabilities as they are delivered to the fleet.

USS Zumwalt embodies the legacy of warfighting excellence and innovation of Adm. Elmo R. Zumwalt, Jr., a veteran of World War II and the conflicts in Korea and Vietnam. He exemplified honor, courage and commitment during 32 years of dedicated naval service. Believing it was his job to “modernize and humanize” the Navy, Zumwalt chose to embrace change and to lead it from within.

“I witnessed as he [Zumwalt] transformed our Navy, one Z-gram at a time… removing demeaning and abrasive regulations and moving to eliminate the scourge of racism and sexism from within our Navy,” said Mabus. “Among many initiatives, he opened flight training to women and increased recruiting of under-represented Americans. And, as has always been the case when we open opportunities in our Navy and Marine Corps, we got stronger.”

As the nineteenth Chief of Naval Operations, Zumwalt embrace of innovation resulted in a number of successful new programs, including the Oliver Hazard Perry-class frigate, the Ohio-class ballistic missile submarine and the F-14 Tomcat, all of which had lasting impacts on the warfighting readiness of the Navy.

Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) Adm. John Richardson, also spoke at the ceremony, commenting on the significance of the ship’s namesake.

“Admiral Zumwalt, especially during his time as CNO, ensured that our institution lived by its values,” said Richardson. “He was the ‘The Sailor’s Admiral,’ looking at new ideas, acting to the limit of his authorities, and adjusting along the way to make his Navy ready for combat – but also with full cognizance of the impact on the Sailors that made up that Navy.”

Perhaps most importantly, Adm. Zumwalt was a social reformer who recognized the primary force-multiplier of the U.S. Navy continued to be its Sailors, and as such began quality of life improvements throughout the Fleet. He was considered a “thinking officer” who was devoted to Sailors and creating an environment where everyone was treated equally – a legacy that can that can be seen today in the diversity of the fleet. His “one Navy” mentality reminds today’s Sailors that taking care of our warfighters ensures the Navy remains tough, bold and ready.

“To say the Navy was transformed by Admiral Zumwalt is an understatement. Indeed, every leader on this stage and the great crew standing before us has benefited from Bud Zuwalt’s passion to make the Navy even better,” said Vice Adm. Tom Rowden, commander, Naval Surface Forces during the ceremony. “So today we welcome this revolutionary warship to the fleet. A ship that demonstrates daring design and cutting-edge capability.”

“On behalf of the U.S. Naval Surface Force, I proudly accept ownership of the Navy’s newest ship to the fleet,” Rowden said.

Zumwalt is scheduled to begin her transit to San Diego, making several port visits along the way. Upon arrival in San Diego, USS Zumwalt will begin installation of her combat systems, testing and evaluation, and operational integration with the fleet.

Once fully integrated, Zumwalt’s stealth, power and lethality will provide a vital link from the Navy’s current needs to its future capabilities.

[serservel]

Non so se essere felice...o triste, per la fisionomia del vascello! Speriamo non abbia anche questo noie al sistema di propulsione

[Iscandar]

Sembrerebbe che non potrà usare i suoi cannoni a lungo, un proiettile costa 800.000$ circa.

 

http://www.difesaonline.it/mondo-militare/scandalo-zumwalt-cancellata-la-torretta-da-155-millimetri-un-singolo-proiettile-costa

[Von Faust*]

Non so se essere felice...o triste, per la fisionomia del vascello! Speriamo non abbia anche questo noie al sistema di propulsione

 

Guardando la foto mi verrebbe da dire "Ok, adesso potete tirare giù il telone per mostracelo.......ah, quello è il vascello ?"

Comunque sia è un bel "mostro" di tecnologia.

[fabio19tdi]

Sarei curioso di vedere come ci si vive a bordo, deve sembrare come un sottomarino per chi ci opera.
Anche le gestione dei gas di scarico e comunque l'emissione di calore mi incuriosisce, come la gestiranno?

Avete accennato ad un apparato motore particolare, ma non ho capito come mai? Potete spiegarlo anche a uno "duro" come me? hehehehe
Da wiki leggevo che 4 tag (2 grandi due piccole) ma su 4 assi!, questo si è in effetti strano.

Si vede due assi sono rientrabili? O possono lavorare tutte contemporaneamente?

[Regia Marina *]

Sarei curioso di vedere come ci si vive a bordo, deve sembrare come un sottomarino per chi ci opera.

Anche le gestione dei gas di scarico e comunque l'emissione di calore mi incuriosisce, come la gestiranno?

Avete accennato ad un apparato motore particolare, ma non ho capito come mai? Potete spiegarlo anche a uno "duro" come me? hehehehe

Da wiki leggevo che 4 tag (2 grandi due piccole) ma su 4 assi!, questo si è in effetti strano.

Si vede due assi sono rientrabili? O possono lavorare tutte contemporaneamente?

 

Da quanto ho potuto leggere in giro in merito dovrebbe essere strutturato nel seguente modo/schema:

 

2 Turbine a Gas Rolls Royce da 35MW circa che danno energia ad altri 2 Motori Elettrici Curtiss-Wright che a loro volta muovono 2 eliche.

 

Inoltre sono presenti altre 2 Turbine a Gas da 3 MW l'una con funzione di generatori, quindi credo per alimentare i sistemi della nave indipendentemente dalla propulsione.

 

Ovviamente va preso con il beneficio del dubbio, non sono un tecnico

[fabio19tdi]

C'avevo pensato, ma mi sembra improbabile tenere accese due tag da 35MW (anche fosse una sola sarebbero 17MW) se non in teatro operativo. Considerando che il rendimento (gr di combustibile per kw ora) delle tag se non a regime di potenza da pessimo che è diventa assurdo.

Io credo che durante le normali operazioni a bassa andatura, per avere rendimenti termodinamici lavorino solo (o anche solo una) della tag piu piccole che alimenta i sistemi di bordo e fornisce energia anche ai motori elettrici sulle eliche.
partono le tag grosse solo quando vogliono correre.
Anche cosi, avrei comunque preferito due bei diesel per la generazione i bassa potenza che hanno si maggiori volumi ma vita maggiore e consumo specifico minore.

Sarei proprio curioso di capirne i perche, anche se non è certo la prima nave CGAG (https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/COGAG) o CGOG (https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/COGOG)

Leggendo wiki trovo qualche idea ma non una soluzione...

Modificato 9 Novembre, 2016 da fabio19tdi

[Totiano*]

Le scelte progettuali americane si sono sempre orientate verso potenze elevate a prescindere dai consumi, inoltre le TAG sembra possano essere meglio silenziate. Poi l'unità ha bisogno di potenze elettriche davvero elevate. tutte ipotesi, ovviamente, ma (detto da chi le ha impiegate, tra cui anche io stesso), le turbine offrono una elasticità di impiego non indifferente

[fabio19tdi]

Siccome io purtroppo esperienze non ne ho nessuna, ma solo letture cosi, dal web, sarei molto curioso di capire meglio cosa si intende con elasticità di impiego paragonando un diesel alla tag in questi casi. Non lavorano entrambi a regime e carico costante come gruppi elettrogeni?
Se provi a farmi capire ti ringrazio molto.

 

P.S: L'Ameriani come si dice qui a Pisa sono fissati con le tag, ci fanno anche i carri armati e poi rimangono a secco nel deserto :P (si scherza)

 

P.S. Le vibrazioni datag sono sicuramente inferiori dal diesel come giustamente scrivi

Modificato 9 Novembre, 2016 da fabio19tdi

[Totiano*]

Io le ho impiegate direttamente sulla propulsione, non come elettrogeneratori, ma le variazioni di carico repentine non sono dissimili, e la reazione alle variazioni di coppia erano quasi inavvertibili sulle TAG a fronte dei problemi che avevano il diesel.

[LT Melekhin *]

Gli Zummwalt non sono né cogag né cogog ma bensì ifep (integrated full electric propulsion)

Non vi sono macchine endotermiche collegate alla propulsione, che è solo elettrica, quindi considerabile come uno degli utenti della rete elettrica nave

[fabio19tdi]

Ma le tag anche quando associate ad un asse elica non lavorano a regime costante, variando solo il passo dell'elica?

Non riesco a capire quali problemi dia un diesel quando gli si chiede una variazione di coppia, è lento? Lo immaginavo piu pronto di una tag pensa un pò hehehe

[Totiano*]

In parte, ai regimi bassi si lavora solo sul passo, poi si aumenta anche il nr dei giri

[fabio19tdi]

Grazie mille, e che range di giri si ha?

[Totiano*]

ecco, questo è un dato riservato... però diciamo a cavallo dei 200 rpm

[fabio19tdi]

Grazie mille, una miniera di informazioni su cui riflettere

[malaparte*]

Sembrerebbe che non potrà usare i suoi cannoni a lungo, un proiettile costa 800.000$ circa.

 

http://www.difesaonline.it/mondo-militare/scandalo-zumwalt-cancellata-la-torretta-da-155-millimetri-un-singolo-proiettile-costa

 

In effetti, si sono accorti che il costo di ogni singolo colpo è un cincino alto... hanno pensato di cambiare munizionamento e utilizzarew missili Excalibur. Questo ovviamente richiede adattamento dei sistemi di tiro.

Anche il costo del programma Zumwalt inizlae è sembrato un cincino fuori budget (32 navi del genere!!! ). "Bisognerà accontersi di 3", hanno pensato

http://www.difesaonline.it/mondo-militare/classe-zumwalt-la-nave-pi%C3%B9-potente-del-mondo-%C3%A8-inoffensiva-proposto-munizionamento

[Totiano*]

Un interessante articolo di portale difesa al link http://www.portaledifesa.it/index~phppag,3_id,2329.html che rilancia una articolo di RID, afferma l'esistenza di un possibile contrordine sugli Zumwalt, ricercando qualcosa di più tradizionale e meno dispendioso per una numeroso serie di incrociatori, un po come hanno fatto con Seawolf e Virginia o come stanno facendo per le LCS e le future fregate. E proprio come quest'ultimo porgramma sembra apriranno le porte anche aprogetti esterni....

[Totiano*]

CONTINUANO I RIPENSAMENTI SUGLI ZUMWALT

Già a gennaio un interessante articolo di Franco Iacch per il Giornale http://www.ilgiornale.it/news/mondo/us-navy-servizio-secondo-cacciatorpediniere-classe-zumwalt-1635304.html riassumeva molto bene la crisi di identità "delle navi più potenti al mondo", tra munizionamenti troppo costosi o non validi ed evoluzione dello scenario strategico mondiale dagli anni 90, in cui gli USA pensavano alle brown waters e al supporto di sbarchi invece che alle crisi in mare aperto, ad oggi dove il confronto è con una flotta cinese  in continua crescita.

(foto https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/28168/zumwalt-stealth-destroyers-now-part-of-experimental-squadron-along-with-drone-ships)

La nuova "vision" per queste unità, come noto ridotte drasticamente da 32 a 3, è di inserirle in una  squadra sperimentale. Riporto uno dei tanti articoli che stanno uscendo in questi giorni   https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/28168/zumwalt-stealth-destroyers-now-part-of-experimental-squadron-along-with-drone-ships con qualche considerazione:

1. I famosi railgun o AGS, parte fondamentale dell'armamento,  sono dati definitivamente e ufficialmente per morti

2. I caccia saranno impegati per attacchi contronave, sostituendo i railgun con VLS

3. nella squadra saranno inserite unità senza equipaggio, droni se volete, a cominciare dai Sea Hunter concepiti per la caccia antisom

4. nel 2024, assieme a droni di maggiore dislocamento non meglio identificati, si aggiungeranno 4 LCS, un altro programma discusso e ridimensionato da 64 a 32 unità di cui "non sanno che farsene"

 

Lo scopo sarebbe quello di testare nuove dottrine di impiego dei mezzi e, più in generale, di guerra sul mare. Chi ha risorse può permettersi di intraprendere nuove rotte riconvertendo i fallimenti in risorse, una cosa che invidio molto agli USA...

 

 

 

 

Quote

 

 

Navy's Stealth Destroyers Now Part Of Experimental Squadron Alongside Drone Ships

 

It's official, the Navy has stood up Surface Development Squadron 1, abbreviated SURFDEVRON, in the place of the already existing Zumwalt Squadron 1 that had been established to operate the Navy three Zumwalt class stealth destroyers. This new experimental unit will not only be responsible for the Zumwalt class ships, it is also tasked with ushering in a new era of unmanned surface warfare and more.

USNI News' Megan Eckstein has put out a great report on the establishment of the outfit, a move that will have far-ranging impacts and could significantly influence the U.S. Navy's future force structure and battle doctrine.

The new unit will first focus on figuring out how the Zumwalt class destroyers' unique capabilities and technologies can be leveraged by the fleet. This is especially important as the ship's identity has changed drastically in recent months following the revelation that its Advanced Gun Systems (AGS) that take up the better part of the front third of the huge destroyers are now considered dead weight as there is no round that can affordably make use of them. 

 

The Navy has since separated the AGS issue from the class's larger mission, deciding to move ahead with getting the ships in operational shape regardless of missing a key reason why they were built. The Zumwalt class will now be focused on surface strike. This could one day include ripping out the guns altogether and replacing them with something else—possibly more vertical launch cells—if the service thinks it's worth spending even more money on the ships that already cost an ungodly amount to develop and procure—roughly $23 billion for just three hulls.  

Other major changes from this new organizational structure include:

• Pairing the Zumwalts with unmanned ships. The first of these vessels will be two Sea Hunter experimental drone ships—one of which has been operating for years and has been incredibly successful—a main reason why the Navy is now betting big on unmanned surface warfare. The other will be delivered in 2020.
• The medium and large drone ships the Navy has set out to procure this year will follow those efforts, working with the Zumwalt class ships experimentally to build a list of key recommendations that will drive everything from future procurement to tactics and procedures for the fleet.
• Between 2020 and 2023 SURFDEVRON will have all three Zumwalt class destroyers operating alongside the two Sea Hunter experimental unmanned surface vehicles (USVs) for experimentation.
• By 2024, medium and large USVs will begin joining the squadron.
• Around that same time, the first four Littoral Combat Ships built, which are now relegated to testing and training, will join SURFDEVRON, as well. This will integrate work they are doing with small USVs, leaving seamless continuity of unmanned surface vehicle experimentation and operation.
• The unit will not just experiment with unmanned assets and the Zumwalt and Littoral Combat Ships themselves, but all types of new mechanical systems, sensors, communications, tactics, procedures, weapons, and more. Overall, the unit is seen as an accelerator of sorts to get new ideas and capabilities to the fleet faster.

What's most interesting in Eckstein's report is that we finally have some details as to how the Zumwalts will actually deploy operationally beyond just functioning in an experimental capacity. 

Eckstein explains it as follows and quotes Vice Admiral Richard Brown, commander of Naval Surface Forces and Naval Surface Force Pacific for further clarification:

As for the Zumwalt destroyers, they will continue with plans to operate as part of a carrier strike group eventually. Under the Optimized Fleet Response Plan, they will go through training and then deploy with the rest of the assigned strike group, but during the sustainment phase – when the CSG would be maintaining its peak readiness at home and being on call for tasking as needed – the DDG-1000s would peel off and conduct experiments instead.

“It is such a unique and capable class of ship. We want to be able to quickly experiment with it,” Brown said. “So the Zumwalt class will be assigned to a carrier strike group, they will do the whole basic, advanced phase of training, integrated training, go deploy, they’ll be in the same under the OFRP, much like a cruiser or destroyer – but the capability that those ships bring is so unique that we really believe they belong in the SURFDEVRON so we can continually and rapidly experiment with them when they’re not on deployment.”

All this sounds intriguing and it seems like a great way to really figure out what the Navy wants in its future fleet, but it is also an expensive and resource-heavy endeavor that may foreshadow exactly what The War Zone has warned of for so long—that the Zumwalt class destroyers could end up only being experimental test ships. 

Due to their unique design that features many one-off components, if these ships aren't out on the front lines, justifying the existence of three of them may become very challenging. As a result, it is possible that one or two of the three ships could end up being cannibalized to keep the remaining hull or hulls functioning. This is especially true if sequester returns or budgets shrink due to changing political winds, a faltering economy, and/or the specter of the ballooning national debt. 

In fact, according to the latest GAO report on the DDG-1000 program, this is already happening:

To limit further delays to DDG 1000 and DDG 1001 construction, the Navy has authorized its shipbuilder to take parts from DDG 1002—the third and final ship of the class, which is under construction. The Navy does not yet know the full extent to which these actions will delay DDG 1002’s construction schedule, but stated that these parts typically can be borrowed and replaced without causing a delay. The Navy has scheduled the ship’s HM&E delivery in March 2020 followed by final delivery in September 2022.

Just replacing the guns is a good example of how hard it is to justify investing more money into such a small fleet and one that has already been woefully watered down in terms of capabilities time and again over the years. In fact, just the change in focus from land attack to surface strike will cost a huge sum of money according to the GAO:

In a January 2018 decision memorandum, the Navy changed DDG 1000’s primary mission from land attack to offensive surface strike. Navy officials are in the process of determining the operational concept for the ship within its new mission. The Navy has yet to establish testing plans to evaluate these future mission sets. According to Navy officials, the Navy’s planned modifications to support the new mission will cost about $1 billion, from non-acquisition accounts.

Time will tell if the Zumwalt class becomes the white elephant many of us have warned it could become or if its tiny cadre of three ships will stay whole and deploy operationally in a reliable manner while also being tasked with experimentation on a grand level. But in the meantime, at least they will be helping the Navy turbocharge its efforts to modernize its forces and get a leg up on the growing peer state threats abroad.